The Lives They're Living

Welcome to the lives they're living.

I'm your host, Ben Yakoda.

The podcast is about people who
have done amazing things and who at

this point in their life are flying
a little bit more under the radar

than they really deserve to be.

My guest today is Robert Strauss.

I once called him the hardest working
man in the journalism business.

I met him many years ago when he
was a reporter at the Bergen Record.

He's worked for newspapers, TV stations
since then, notably as a freelancer

and stringer for the New York Times.

He's had well over 1, 000 bylines,
which is more than A lot of their

staff writers, , he's the author of
three books, , in order, , Daddy's

Little Goalie, a father, his daughter
in sports, worst period, president

period, ever period, James Buchanan,
the POTUS rating game and the legacy

of the least of the lesser presidents.

That, that's a mouthful.

, and I, I think he might.

Be in another book, the Guinness
book of world records for the longest

time to get a master's degree.

I think he started in 1973 and
he's finishing it up right now

at UC Berkeley as we speak.

So Robert Strauss, welcome
to the lives they're living.

I, well, I'm glad to be
living with my friends lives.

That makes two of us.

So I I'm excited to talk
about our subject today.

, who is Lois Smith and I'll just give a
brief bio and then we can get into your

connection , she is a distinguished
actress of stage, screen, film, and TV.

And one notable thing about her
is that she, she's venerable.

She was born in Kansas in 1930.

Her name at birth was Lois Humbert.

She married a man named Wesley
Dale Smith, , and lived with him in

Washington State, but they both moved
in to New York in 1951 to be actors.

And Lois Smith made her Broadway debut
in 1952, appeared in a number of plays.

In the fifties, including The
Glass Menagerie by Tennessee

Williams with Helen Hayes.

She made her film debut in 1955 in
East of Eden with James Dean and later

played supporting roles in such films
as Five Easy Pieces, Fatal Attraction,

Fried Green Tomatoes, Dead Man Walking,
Twister, Minority Report, Lady Bird,

and The French Dispatch from 2021.

Probably her most recent role was in
2017 when she was the lead in the science

fiction drama Marjorie Prime, for which
she was nominated for, , many awards.

On TV, she was a regular cast member
in the horror drama True Blood.

, received a Critics Choice Award for
her performance in The Americans.

She was in 253 episodes of The Soap
Op of The Doctors, also ER, Mom, and

last year, four episodes of Law Order.

But she's probably best known, this is
going to take up the whole episode, I'm

sorry for the length of this, I cut it
down, , her extensive work in the theater.

three time Tony Award nominee, and
she won the Tony in for Best Featured

Actress in 2020 for a performance in
The Inheritance, becoming the oldest

performer to win a Tony Award for acting.

Also nominated for her roles in The
Grapes of Wrath, Buried Child, and, , she

was an acclaimed off Broadway revival
of The Trip to Bountiful in 2005 and

received an Obie Award for Best Actress.

And I'll just stop right there.

So, , unbelievable.

Tell me where, where and when
and how you came to know her

because , she's a friend of yours.

Yes, she is a friend of mine.

, I came to know her because, , when I was
at the Bergen Record when you met me,

I was living in the Upper West Side of
New York back when it was affordable.

Even though I had a fourth
floor walk up and below me with

this actor, David Margulies.

Now, I didn't know he was an actor really,
except that he first time I saw him,

he was grumbling about the landlord.

And so he got me to organize it.

A rent strike he said he was an
actor and he taught at Rutgers.

Well, to me, that meant he was a
professor at Rutgers and he acted

in community theater or something.

Well, the, the record gave
me a, . A lousy shift, 8 p.

m.

to 4 a.

m.,

so I was pissed, and I saw that there
was going to be this opening of a movie

on the east side, in the afternoon of
whatever day it was, , so I went there.

And it was, about the blacklist.

Was it the front?

The front, yes.

Okay, so it was the front.

So I go into the theater and
the movie goes on and about.

movie.

There's David on the screen.

And so I stand up and start screaming.

Oh my God.

Oh my God.

Right.

I know him.

I know that guy.

Anyway, the reason why I bring up David
is because that's how I know Lois.

He was a rather distinguished
actor, I think too, much the same

way she was in a lot of things.

And, , I moved back to Philadelphia and
he came be in a play in Philadelphia.

It was a touring play with Katherine
Hepburn and Dorothy Loudon.

And, I had him stay at my
house and I became a patron of

the theater from that point on.

He would send me people from New
York, the theaters would send me

people to live in my house because
I would let them live there.

For free and they give me tickets to
the play and you know So you were like

kind of the medici of of of philadelphia
you were through your largesse You

were supporting the theatrical arts.

One time the this guy , larry pine
who's a rather famed, soap actor, but

he was the , standby in a play that
richard burton and Elizabeth Taylor

were doing and, uh, he calls me up one
day when he comes back from the theater

because I don't know where I was.

He says, you want to go to
Elizabeth Taylor's birthday party?

No, you know, of course.

Well, all the backstage people
knew me because I would.

You know, come by.

And so what they had done, it was at
the four seasons, it was in the, just

the bar area and they all sat in other
seats, but they cleared out the space

on the couch next to Elizabeth Taylor.

So I think I was there the
whole time with my mouth open,

you know, three feet from her.

So anyway, so back to Lois.

David and Lois were in a You
know, they have sort of fraternity

theaters, you know what I mean?

Steppenwolf in Chicago, regional theaters.

Yeah, right.

Absolutely.

But they have them in New York too.

And they were members of
the ensemble studio theater.

I'm by a guy named Kurt Dempster,
but lots of people were in it.

And, , David had started going
out with Lois at some point.

I think her, her first husband, uh, Mr.

Smith had.

Either he had passed away or they
divorced and then she divorced and then

she started going out with David, right?

And, that's how I got to know them.

And, , over the years I
would go to their play.

I would always go to their
plays, you know, uh, See their

movies, whatever else it was.

But also Lois had another connection to
Philly because she was in the theater

for living of the living arts when
it was run by Andre Gregory, who was.

A famous,, director of that.

My dinner with Andre was
about him, uh, years later.

So yeah, the theater of living
arts, he ran, and that was

before my time in Philly.

That was like, I think in the
seventies, that was kind of a big deal.

I think she was still married
to, uh, Smith then because

her daughter lives in Philly.

Her daughter is the wife , of
a rabbi in Philadelphia.

Her name is Moon Smith.

Now, how you can have such a, regular
last name and an irregular first name.

Yeah.

But nonetheless, that's how you go, right?

, they would often perform.

They, they did a show that I saw in
Longmore up in, , Connecticut, . And,

uh, it was called Lil's 90th.

So even then, when they were in
their 70s, I they were performing

as older people, even older people.

But what I think is wonderful
about Lois is that she's 94

and is still working hard.

Unbelievable.

She'll send me an email.

She said, ah I just did two long orders,
you know, or something like this, you

know, I'll say, how are you doing?

And he says, oh, I haven't worked
in a month, you know what I mean?

just that, that resume looking at it,
that I did just at the high points, I

mean, she is a working actor and I guess.

The term might be character actor, even
though she was the lead in Marjorie

Prime, and maybe this is just my, limited
view, but I think of that as more of

a, male thing, but she is very much
it, and, and the different ones, the

Five Easy Pieces, , East of Eden, , Lady
Bird, where she had a, a great role,

they're all different and distinctive,
, And so I wondered like knowing her

to be a character actor in that
kind, I would think , you would

have to not have like a big ego
that kind of is all over the place.

So what's her personality and how
does that fit into her acting?

One time I wanted to do, a story about
her, like, I don't know, New York

times magazine or some something,

and she said, I don't want to do it.

You know, it's like, it's like
if you had, if you needed me

for a quote, that would be okay.

Why didn't she want to do it?

Because she didn't feel that it was
like something that she should do.

She wasn't Elizabeth Taylor.

She was more, what, self effacing?

. Not that she's not confident in her work.

And it's not that she
doesn't try to do it.

And it's not that she wasn't
proud of winning the Tony..

That play was one of those two night
kind of plays, you know, the inheritance.

So imagine this, imagine being 90 or 91
or however old she was when, when she

won the Tony and having the stamina to do
many nights and like eight shows a week.

And she obviously had
to be on stage a lot.

, so when David died, A few years ago,
I, I continued to keep up with her

and I decided that I, , last winter
now, not this, the winter that we're

in, but the winter before, , I said,
well, I'm coming up at Christmas.

Let's go to a play.

And so my cousin Mara Isaacs is
now a go to, Broadway producer.

, she produced Gypsy and she had
produced Hadestown and the actor.

that played Hades in Hadestown.

Patrick Page was doing a
thing on, Shakespeare's

villains down by Union Square,

so, you know, I wait, Lois and I go
to the play and she says, I don't know

anything about Shakespeare's villains.

This is good for me.

This is like an education.

I don't know if people would quantify
it somewhere, but she's got to

be the person who's been in the
most things after the age of 80.

I would think.

, I did look at the Wikipedia page.

I sure have not seen anybody with more
credits and you know, their meaty roles.

A lot of them, they're
not just kind of walk ons.

, and she does comedy too.

I saw a clip from the sitcom mom with
Alison Janney, where she just had.

What seemed to be a small
role and she just nailed it.

A zinger on there, , was just great.

She's definitely still got the chops.

She wasn't a New Yorker story recently
that somehow had to do with Tennessee

Williams , you know, and she was in.

Glass Menagerie, I think.

Yeah, yeah.

Glass Menagerie with Helen
Hayes, of all people.

We're talking about her roles in her
older years, but let's go back, , to

the first prominent film role she had,
which was East of Eden, 1955, , James

Dean's first film, I think, directed
by Ilya Kazan and, on YouTube, and

I'll put a link to this in the show
notes is this amazing clip of yes.

The screen test between her and
James Dean, and it's It's silent.

Seemingly the director is telling them
do this, do that, but you don't hear

that there's a kind of hokey piano music
that I wish were not, but it's the most,

it's really sexy and she just, both
of them, actually, she, a little bit

more than her jumps off of the screen.

, do you know anything about that role?

I actually confess, I
haven't seen the movie.

Maybe not at all.

Maybe in many, many, many
years, but I'm going to see it.

, Ben, as you know, we travel a lot and
I was on some plane a couple of years

ago going to, , The Arabian Peninsula.

So I had a long time on Cotter
Airways, and they have a very

extensive free film thing.

So I had my own little
Lois Smith, film festival.

I saw East of Eden and Five Easy Pieces.

She plays this role in East of Eden
that, , while it's not, Joe Van

Fleet you, you get the idea that he's
hustling her, you know, that, that

James Dean , is trying to date her,

knowing her from the time she was in
her 40s till now, to see her as this

young, presumably ingenue, because
she'd already been on Broadway a

couple of times by that point, , But
you're right about James Dean.

It's the only movie that, , appeared
that, , played while he was alive.

Here's a clip from Lois and James Dean's
scene in East of Eden, followed by an

interview that Lois did about him for
an American Masters documentary in 2005.

Look, kid, please don't start any trouble.

I'm not gonna start any trouble.

Come on.

You can just point to the
door to me and I'll go there.

No, honest.

This is a tough place.

I can't lose this job.

I'm very good at it anyway.

You won't lose it.

If I step out of line, Kay
will throw me out on my ear.

Come on.

Come on.

You can just show me where the door is.

I just remember how careful it was.

I've always had the sense,
what good care, Jimmy had taken

care of for his first film.

And the other sense I had
is, how really good he was.

I mean, how really.

And I had nothing to compare it with.

I simply was impressed

one of the things that struck me
and it's interesting given her stage

and screen work and and the thing
in this Screen test and and looking

at the five easy pieces performance.

We'll talk about in a minute.

Um, it's her eyes.

I mean, there's so Uh expressive and
soulful and I think big too and it just

works well on the screen really striking.

Presence to her.

Lois wanted to, , treat me to a play after
I, Treated her, so last summer, and my

wife wanted to see something else, but
Lois said, well, let's go to Uncle Vanya.

She and David loved all those kinds
of, , playwrights, , you know,

and then all those kind of people.

so I said, fine, you know, I don't know
that I had ever seen another production

of Vanya, but it's at Lincoln Center and
it's a nice day, you know, so, , I get

there and we meet in the lobby and to
show you how old we are, she actually

had paper tickets, you know, daughter
come up from Philly, so she has three

tickets in her hand and we're trying
to find like the right entrance, you

know, and, this woman comes I Out of
nowhere, grabs the tickets out, LO's

hands and says, I can do better for you.

. And we, we , we don't know
what's, what's happening.

You know, we're even, her
daughter's fairly old, you know,

it's like we're, we're three
old people seeing a play center.

A couple minutes later, this woman
comes back and she says, follow me.

She's got three other tickets in her
hand . And we get to the sort of the

entrance to go into the theater and she
says, it's shame you aren't here tonight.

Helen's coming.

I didn't know Helen, you know, was Helen
hunt because they were twister together.

You know, I mean, in a way,
Lois is the Kevin Bacon.

It's nice to hear that she is.

Recognized in both senses of the
word, I mean, awarded and honored,

but also people, you know, notice her.

Of course, of course, now
we're eighth row center, right?

Anyway, , so we're done.

And now we're waiting in the courtyard
of, uh, Lincoln Center till my wife shows

up from whatever place she's going to.

And we're just chatting.

And this middle aged
man comes , over to us.

And he just, he can't stay, he doesn't
want to stand too close to Lois, you

know, he just doesn't say, Oh, I just.

I can't believe I see you here, you know,
and it goes on in that sort of mode.

Uh, you know, you're just, you've
just been the best for so long.

So, you know, even, even Even
though she's a 90 year old

woman, or now she's 95, right?

94.

And, , he couldn't just stop gushing.

If you were with her for one
afternoon and had two things like

that, she must get it a fair amount.

And how does she handle that?

I assumed, I know she's modest from what
I've heard you know, she does take these

parts that are somewhat incidental.

I mean, in the French dispatch, right?

There's several segments of that movie
and she plays the older art collector

so it's a, it's a, it's a thing where
she's on screen for 10 minutes at best,

I would say, Lady Bird, the same way
she's, , one of the teachers, mother

superior or whatever in the school
that, , Lady Bird goes to and, , so

she's in and out maybe four times.

As I mentioned, one of her more recent,
larger roles is in the 2017 science

fiction film Marjorie Prime, where she
plays an older woman, and John Hamm

is a hologram of her late husband.

Here's a scene with Lois Smith
and John Hamm from Marjorie Prime.

You said I'd get better, but you're
the one who's getting better.

We've only been talking a few months.

Part of it is biology.

I know.

Your genetic inclination.

Which is to leave everything behind.

Too packed lately.

I don't have to get better.

Just keep me from getting worse.

Promise.

I can't promise.

She, she's just must feel like I gotta
keep doing this, you know, whatever it is.

I feel that way.

You probably do too.

. What we do is, is something we like doing
it and we want to keep on doing it and

we're lucky to have that opportunity.

I did want to briefly talk
about, , another is she got award

nominations for, which was the five
easy pieces that you mentioned.

East of Eden, it was 1955.

This was 1970 is 15 years later.

She's, you know, mature person and
she plays Jack Nicholson's sister.

The only person, the only two.

People that he seems to like, the
character seems to like, are her and

their father, everybody else in the
movie he just doesn't get along with.

Yeah, yeah.

And, um, , it was Again, like a
supporting role, but she just did

it so convincingly and, , great job.

I did watch it again last night on
your say so, , the little clip you

gave me actually kept on going to.

Continuous five minute clips.

It really is a really good movie.

I mean, it's got some
really good people in it.

I mean, Karen black places, you know,
gum chewing, waitress Nicholson somehow

takes a shine to for a little while

Ralph wait is in it, you know what I mean?

In any case, the movie's made in 1970
and it definitely is a period piece.

But 1970 is 55 years ago, you know?

Right, right.

Wow.

It's kind of amazing.

I mean, so that was 1970.

We were around in 1970.

Were we watching movies from 1915?

Then No, no 55 years before that.

Well, chaplain, you know
too realer or something.

But it seems that, um I don't know whether
time has collapsed or, , you know, a

friend of mine was commenting about how
his kids who were in their thirties and.

Love the music of the 70s.

When they were hadn't
been born for 20 years.

So it time is, I don't know, I don't
have the right metaphor, but but

things from that long ago seem to be
more relevant now than that same gap.

And I'll have to have an expert on to
tell me about that in a future episode.

Well, you can think about the president
in 1970, which it was Nixon, right?

And president in 1915, I don't
think you're looking to talk about.

Right, right.

Yeah.

Obviously you're still in touch with Lois.

And as I mentioned, she apparently
was on four episodes of law and order.

Just this last year.

So I'm thinking that she's
still working, right?

Like I said, she'll send me a
note and said, I'm really busy.

I have to fly out to Los Angeles.

You know, for a few days, you know,
once again, it'll be, I'm sure it'll

be some movie where she's in for 10
minutes, well, you know, we have our

friend, Ronnie, Ronnie Poloneski, his
daughter was in a movie with Lois.

. So Addie, , is, is an actress.

And what was the one she was in with?

It was a Diane Keaton movie
with two people's names in it.

The young woman who plays the young
Diane Keaton wishes to be older, right?

Or, or it's the opposite.

I forget whether Diane Keaton wishes
to be younger, but so there's a

cast of people who are her friend,
her young person's friends.

Of which Addie is one, and then
there are the older friends that

hang out with her, and Lois is one
of them, . You mentioned Kevin Bacon.

I say there's six degrees
of Robert Strauss.

The connections, , are friend's daughter,
Addie Weirich, who's the actress, and

Lois Smith and David Margulies, , and
many other people that you've encountered

on the basketball court and elsewhere.

Well, please When you're in touch with
Lois Smith, tell her, thank you for me.

I'm another fan boy.

Like the guy you met outside Lincoln
center for her amazing career.

, I think she, if not now is going to
be in the Guinness book of records

along with you story about this.

One time I was at a party at
David's house and there was this guy

sitting on a seat over there, you
know, it wasn't like a big party.

And I, and I lean over to the person who
I was with, who I forget who it was now.

And I said, That's Dr.

No, it was Joseph Wiseman who played Dr.

No in the James Bond movie, but of
course he played an Asian person.

So how would I have even recognized him?

That's why I loved hanging out with
these actors and having them in my

house and all that other sort of thing.

It was, it was quite a, a time for For
for that, unfortunately people are getting

old and dying but that's life that is
that is that is life And that is too bad.

Well, please tell lois smith Thank
you, and I thank you as well for

talking about her on the lives.

They're living It's been fun as always'

Just a couple of days after recording
this interview, I got an email from

Robert Strauss reporting he'd gotten
one from Noah Smith, and he gave me

permission to share a little bit of it.

Uh, she says, the film script and
the works for a long time is finished

and good, shooting in June July.

A short film I shot in September.

Turned out well.

A film I shot two and a half years ago
will open next month, and one that I

shot a year ago is nearly finished.

So Lois Smith very much
still active and working.

Now, here's your moment of Lois Smith.

I was thinking a lot about
how we do it all together, and

that's the only way we can do it.

And that's probably, that's not the only
thing, but that is a very big thing.

I remember rather young when I was
sort of beginning and, and thinking,

Oh, I have to look inside myself.

And that's a very alone, lonely thing.

But then what I find there,
I have to bring it out and

bring it to all of us together.

Thanks for listening, and
we'll see you next time.